[Pil-pc-oceania] Jims permaculture

[pamela]

Ouch that hurt!! :)
I did not mean it in a 'gestaop' like manner Cecile and appreciate where you
are coming from. I have worked for Cuba ,( and also in  many countries in
South America and Africa) and am not sure what comparison in particular you
are drawing. Particularly as there are not many other comparisons one can
make with Cuba. Cuba being so much a singular example due to their political
and social and isolated development. In so many ways I wish we had the
opportunities that this has strangely created for Cuba to do things so well.
But, we are not Cuba, and can not do it in that way we have so many other
forces that go against us.
I am not apologizing however on the strength of my feeling re properly
trained people. I agree wholeheartedly with Robyn who is more eloquent than
I (obviously) 
:) There is a very great need to get people into the field who can meet the
changes on the way and wishy washy practitioners interpreting 'permaculture'
in one and only one sense, calling themselves 'designers' sends shudders
down my spine. I can tell you. 30 years in the nursery industry and as a
horticulturist I have seen it all before as others will contend I am sure. 
The Permie movement is poised to gain (finally) some ground and build
momentum, as you are inferring. Surely we want to put the best foot forward,
support the APT training program, get tough on the accreditation and
maintain a high standard. 
I am not suggesting that we can't build 'on the ground' momentum with PDC
training which is intrinsically important. I am particularly talking about
Permaculture Designing as a profession. Ie. Creating spaces for others.
Perhaps the best example of this I can give here is retrofitting existing
gardens in urban areas, surely the biggest challenge and biggest opportunity
to make permaculture a 'mindset', a 'norm' rather than a choice??

Kind regards to  you Cecile, thanks for your post.
Pam


Pamela Gurner-Hall
Lecturer TAFESA and Uni of Adelaide
Sustainable Design Studio ( South)
Landscape Designer and Horticultural Consultant
P.O Box 1054
Aldinga Beach 5173
phone 0419 213 237
 

Message: 1
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 16:27:22 +0930
From: "Cecile" <anhinga at internode.on.net>
Subject: Re: [Pil-pc-oceania] Jims permaculture
To: "'permacultue discussion list'"
	<pil-pc-oceania at lists.permacultureinternational.org>
Message-ID: <000901c7c451$e74321c0$1101a8c0 at Anhinga>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

What you are saying Pamela would seem to negate everything that has been
done in Cuba.  We are in critical times - with Peak Oil and climate change
we face even worse than the Cuban situation (see the DVD The Power of
Community if not yet seen) and will need dramatic measures.  I fear we no
longer have the time or money for the luxurious methods you outlline below.
'Strong hold' sends shivers of Gestapo fear down my spine.
Cheers
Cecile